Level 60+ Mind Flay on Druid, Very Low Damage. Possibly a bug

[harshmellow]

TLDR level 64 Mind Flay does barely any damage and I don't understand why. I also think it may be a bug.

I'm trying to build a druid around the Eye of the Storm SSU Viper Bow (level 58 Mind Flay lightning spell, firing 4 beams and penetrates 50% lightning res on bow).

I'm playing on nightmare at level 100 with 600% strength factor to spell damage, with 100% lightning penetration. My gear isn't perfectly optimized.

My mind flay damage shows 827-1031. I can barely kill anything in nightmare, let alone trying to get to end game. I was excited for this base level 58 Mind Flay build and it does nothing. I suspect this skill might not be scaling correctly. Is there something I don't understand? Or is something wrong?

[demonshalo]

800-1k

You´re wrong about one thing, this isn´t a bug, it´s how Median is now - REJOICE!

The problem is that the oskill list in its current form is made of liquid poop. Don´t bother trying to be creative, the game does not support it. You have a better chance killing a1 fallen using your fist and a bugged charged strike than trying to deal any dmg using 90% of the skills on that list. And that´s not a joke. I mean it literally!

If you want to have your mind blown, equip a large number of those skills and write down their dmg in a spreadsheet and soon enough you´ll realize one thing: a lot of them deal almost the exact same dmg. The only difference is the particle animation on the screen.

[mortimer_85]

too boost your damage you have to increase your Spell damage bonus (% all Spell damage or ligthning Spell damage) and the Synergies.
Use Spell damage buffing Aura from your acid fiends, as soon as you get Symbiosis you can push your Bonus to lightning Spell damage even further with putting points into mythal.

600 Strength factor to Spell damage does 'nothing' without heavy investment into strenght. (Synergy Bonus is str*SF/150000)
I would go Faery in progress for more tankiness. str, dex as needed for gear, rest into Energy to push the stat only Synergy from mindflay. most important stats on rest of gear (for pushing damage) Lightning Spell damage, Energy (flat and percentage), Energy factor to Spell damage (as soon as you hit the 2000 energy mark, invest more into EF).

As an osill caster dudu I recommend smaxing acid fiends, mythal and putting 26 points into elvensong in endgame, Pagan Rites one pointer.

[harshmellow]

800-1k

You´re wrong about one thing, this isn´t a bug, it´s how Median is now - REJOICE!

The problem is that the oskill list in its current form is made of liquid poop. Don´t bother trying to be creative, the game does not support it. You have a better chance killing a1 fallen using your fist and a bugged charged strike than trying to deal any dmg using 90% of the skills on that list. And that´s not a joke. I mean it literally!

If you want to have your mind blown, equip a large number of those skills and write down their dmg in a spreadsheet and soon enough you´ll realize one thing: a lot of them deal almost the exact same dmg. The only difference is the particle animation on the screen.

So I understand, are you saying my level 60 mind flay, point for point, is weaker than if a Paladin took it from his skill tree?

[Bagboy_Brown]

800-1k

You´re wrong about one thing, this isn´t a bug, it´s how Median is now - REJOICE!

The problem is that the oskill list in its current form is made of liquid poop. Don´t bother trying to be creative, the game does not support it. You have a better chance killing a1 fallen using your fist and a bugged charged strike than trying to deal any dmg using 90% of the skills on that list. And that´s not a joke. I mean it literally!

If you want to have your mind blown, equip a large number of those skills and write down their dmg in a spreadsheet and soon enough you´ll realize one thing: a lot of them deal almost the exact same dmg. The only difference is the particle animation on the screen.

So I understand, are you saying my level 60 mind flay, point for point, is weaker than if a Paladin took it from his skill tree?

It should be the same as long as you have STR = to the paladin, right?

[demonshalo]

800-1k

You´re wrong about one thing, this isn´t a bug, it´s how Median is now - REJOICE!

The problem is that the oskill list in its current form is made of liquid poop. Don´t bother trying to be creative, the game does not support it. You have a better chance killing a1 fallen using your fist and a bugged charged strike than trying to deal any dmg using 90% of the skills on that list. And that´s not a joke. I mean it literally!

If you want to have your mind blown, equip a large number of those skills and write down their dmg in a spreadsheet and soon enough you´ll realize one thing: a lot of them deal almost the exact same dmg. The only difference is the particle animation on the screen.

So I understand, are you saying my level 60 mind flay, point for point, is weaker than if a Paladin took it from his skill tree?

I am not sure about mind flay tbh as I have not done a MF paly before. My guess would be that Paladin mindflay 1k max dmg can be reached at around 25+ skill level with like 1200 energy or so if you use 0 spell dmg and no items/charms (naked char). This is a pure guess though based on my testing of other skills that scale similarly.

Now if you have like 25% spell dmg with say 500ish energy and level 25+ mind flay, paly can probably reach that 1k dmg target. Again this is a ball park guess but as you can see, it´s rather trivial to scale it as getting 300-400% spell dmg with 1500+ energy should be a piece of cake for a paly.

So to answer your question straight up: I am not sure if mind flay scales any differently as an oskill. But it being an oskill that scales the way it does means that it is about as dogshit as the wine I am drinking right now!

edit: in fact, let me go run some tests. I will report back in a few mins. Please reply to this comment with the following values:

your energy
your % light spell dmg
your level of mind flay atm
your energy factor
your strength
your strength factor

[harshmellow]

255 energy
49% lightning damage
Level 60 Mind Flay
69 Energy Factor
Plus 42% elemental damage from acid fiends
Plus 10% elemental from mark of the wild

Mind flay tooltip: 1246-1553

Based on someone else's tip I won't bother with STR factor for now, if at all. So 0 STR factor.

I know these stats are bush league, I just want to know if this can be viable.

[demonshalo]

255 energy
49% lightning damage
Level 60 Mind Flay
69 Energy Factor
Plus 42% elemental damage from acid fiends
Plus 10% elemental from mark of the wild

Mind flay tooltip: 1246-1553

Based on someone else's tip I won't bother with STR factor for now, if at all. So 0 STR factor.

I know these stats are bush league, I just want to know if this can be viable.

Mind Flay tooltip is per projectile IIRC. I might be wrong about that though. Regardless...

You dmg as an oskill is scaling in line with the native skill roughly speaking if my eyes are not all fucked after all the testing that I´ve done. The thing you need to keep in mind is that in order to scale spells you need to do what mortimer suggested, skill levels, spell dmg, energy and EF. At your stage, % spell dmg is the go to method as you still don´t have what it takes to make EF work.

at 49% spell dmg, you will barely see any dmg output. Generally you want to be in the 3-400 ballpark. Heck, various variations of casters can reach 5-600+. The issue you are going to run into is that the skill level matters very little as the scaling per level is rather low in itself. The lvl 60 skill damage is going to be used as base for the % spell dmg to be applied to. That is the reason it feels like low dmg --> because as a native skill, paladin can inflate its damage using things like superbeast, stormlord, etc. So as a skill it has to be balanced in a way that makes sense for the paly to use. Putting it in a druid´s hands can only work if you run it with high level symbiosis + mythal + fiends + energy + lots of crafted % spell dmg gear. And even then it probably won´t work.

In addition, you are using a bow, which means that you are by default handicapped because you can´t use a 13sk 80%+ spell dmg 2h druid staff. The bow also lacks % spell dmg and there is no good quiver to compliment it. What all of this tells me is that this bow oskill, like almost all other oskills, is shaped in a way to be more of a meme than viable. You´ll find the same memeing mentality with StormFront druid which has btw been buffed by ~100% since last patch and still is garbage. If you want to use that bow with Mind Flay do so late game when you have lots of charms, ornate shrines and some crafted gears. Trying to level up and scale with it is an uphill battle against the "balancing mechanics" (which sadly is not a fight you can win easily).

Conclusion: I´ve been flailing about the oskill list for a reason. Most of it is there as end-game meme content and does not make for viable builds. If you want to do some useful caster light druid build, try StormFront, Other than that... yea! good luck :/

[harshmellow]

Thanks for your input that was very useful. I didn't consider it may just be a weak spell because pally can buff himself so much. The truth hurts.

[demonshalo]

Thanks for your input that was very useful. I didn't consider it may just be a weak spell because pally can buff himself so much. The truth hurts.

Eh, you live and learn. We´ve all been there

Level up as a native fire caster druid and you´ll have 200x as much fun because it will be able to kill shit. Anyway, good luck good sir!