Complaints and Grievances

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Jelle
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whist wrote:
SwineFlu wrote:Since Marco in the mood to practice his political speech skills, would be interesting to hear some plausible explanation what takes team so long to embed in the core something as simple as multipage stash. PVPGN support is out of the question obviously, there in no open source projects with such functionality, however it's worth a few dozen lines of code to make it work for a single player or tcp/ip game. Half a year is definitely more than enough to copy&paste an existing code that was tested for years by thousands and thousands of players, can't go wrong with it.


It's not because we can that we should. For starters, plugy's source code is distributed under a GNU GPL license, I'll let you google and figure out what that implies. And past that, there's also the fact that splitting a relatively big amount of functionalities into two different paradigms to enable this feature in SP only isn't really smart from a code maintenance and scalability point of view. If we forget about the ugliness it introduces in the code base, there's also this to consider: this particular functionality involves many client-side changes, meaning SP and MP players would need to use a different dll to play, that's a big NOPE. The smarter way is to develop a solution that works both for SP and MP, which is still in our roadmap, and isn't "out of the question" as you said. The reason this hasn't been done yet is because there were plenty of higher priority tasks to tackle down, mostly bugs.

Edit: after some thought, the client changes could be introduced in a way that allows the same dll to work both for sp and mp but that would also introduce even more splitting and condition spaghetti, so that's still a big nope from me.


It seems like you're removing all the benefits of SP one by one in an attempt to force people onto MP. So much was promised years ago when the migration away from D2SE and PlugY started and so little was delivered.

Excellent job on Sigma. Such a shame that you despise SP though.
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whist
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Jelle wrote:It seems like you're removing all the benefits of SP one by one in an attempt to force people onto MP. So much was promised years ago when the migration away from D2SE and PlugY started and so little was delivered.

Excellent job on Sigma. Such a shame that you despise SP though.


Of course, that makes sense, that's why we increased drop rates and experience gains in SP, because we despise it and want to "remove all the benefits of SP one by one in an attempt to force people onto MP". That's also the reason we specifically allowed (and even feature/recommend) tools like Kambala's offline tools, because we want the SP experience to be as bad as possible :coolstorybob:

Keep in mind that if we despised SP so much, it would be removed for good. You might want to reflect on that before coming in here and spreading your conspiracy theories.
vitos21340
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10 | 4
Sigma became a commercial,on the server on the contrary there are no advantages now(shit tg and zero drop),want to lure people to the server,only the game did not change over the years,experience with changes in figures are taken from D3,Good Work!!!
Jelle
Cultist
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whist wrote:
Jelle wrote:It seems like you're removing all the benefits of SP one by one in an attempt to force people onto MP. So much was promised years ago when the migration away from D2SE and PlugY started and so little was delivered.

Excellent job on Sigma. Such a shame that you despise SP though.


Of course, that makes sense, that's why we increased drop rates and experience gains in SP, because we despise it and want to "remove all the benefits of SP one by one in an attempt to force people onto MP". That's also the reason we specifically allowed (and even feature/recommend) tools like Kambala's offline tools, because we want the SP experience to be as bad as possible :coolstorybob:

Keep in mind that if we despised SP so much, it would be removed for good. You might want to reflect on that before coming in here and spreading your conspiracy theories.


When you say "increased drop rates and experience gains in SP" you mean nerfed them (compared to the code from M2012 you're based on). Being creative about the truth is dope.

Anyway, I'm simply saying that you have sacrificed SP in pursuit of MP features. And by the number of complaints I've seen over the years it looks like a lot of people feel this way. If that's a sacrifice you're fine with then own it. But currently, it seems like you feel that SP is better than ever and in that case, you might wanna ask yourself why people keep complaining about it.
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RequiemLux
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Jelle wrote:
whist wrote:
Jelle wrote:It seems like you're removing all the benefits of SP one by one in an attempt to force people onto MP. So much was promised years ago when the migration away from D2SE and PlugY started and so little was delivered.
Excellent job on Sigma. Such a shame that you despise SP though.


Of course, that makes sense, that's why we increased drop rates and experience gains in SP, because we despise it and want to "remove all the benefits of SP one by one in an attempt to force people onto MP". That's also the reason we specifically allowed (and even feature/recommend) tools like Kambala's offline tools, because we want the SP experience to be as bad as possible :coolstorybob:
Keep in mind that if we despised SP so much, it would be removed for good. You might want to reflect on that before coming in here and spreading your conspiracy theories.


When you say "increased drop rates and experience gains in SP" you mean nerfed them (compared to the code from M2012 you're based on). Being creative about the truth is dope.

Anyway, I'm simply saying that you have sacrificed SP in pursuit of MP features. And by the number of complaints I've seen over the years it looks like a lot of people feel this way. If that's a sacrifice you're fine with then own it. But currently, it seems like you feel that SP is better than ever and in that case, you might wanna ask yourself why people keep complaining about it.


What?
Pretty sure whist doesn't feel like SP is better than ever. On numerous occasions has been reiterated that improvements are planned and are being worked on.
With the Unique Item Rework and the sets rework, a lot of junk has been removed, you get better items faster. MXLS balance wise is a very different game from the mod previous iterations, and droprates have been (and will continually be) adjusted accordingly. Things are not perfect ofc but this is the very reason the dev team keep working hard on improving it. Just go compare an Ultimative changelog with a Sigma one, even despite the M17 transition, with every ladder we get an amount of content previously unthinkable, it takes time to set everything in the right place...
Think how much HC is now viable compared to pre-Sigma versions, everything will keep getting better for SP too. Don't get frustrated, find enjoyment in what you have and be patient, people who love the project are at work.
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Marco
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Jelle wrote:Such a shame that you despise SP though.


Releasing the mod on SP implied exposing all intellectual property of the new engine to be reversed (as opposed to having a server-only engine as pretty much most modern games - which would also have allowed us to do lots of cool stuff), in addition to allowing it being stolen by diff communities (such as chinese one) which profit from it. In exchange, we have gotten nothing but complaints.

Gotta love when leeches complain how greedy we are.
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Rishab
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I cant believe i m not getting exactly what i didn't pay for, i damn it!
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Jelle
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Marco wrote:
Jelle wrote:Such a shame that you despise SP though.


Releasing the mod on SP implied exposing all intellectual property of the new engine to be reversed (as opposed to having a server-only engine as pretty much most modern games - which would also have allowed us to do lots of cool stuff), in addition to allowing it being stolen by diff communities (such as chinese one) which profit from it. In exchange, we have gotten nothing but complaints.

Gotta love when leeches complain how greedy we are.


Wanna show me where I mentioned anything about being greedy? Or is a straw man argument really the route you wanna take...

Literally all mods are "exposing all intellectual property", I don't know why you wanna pretend it's a big thing Sigma has done the same. Heck, other mods exposing their work is the entire reason Sigma exists to begin with.

You seem like a smart guy, but calling your long-time players for "leeches" makes it sound a lot like you have forgot what modding is about. (It also violates your own forum rules, but I got too thick skin to seriously complain about that).

Kudos for responding. Not so much for the lack of maturity.

edit: forgot to respond to
@RequiemLux
I love the message you're trying to convey, I really do... But the bottom line is that drop rates have been nerfed a metric f*ckton on SP. There's is no small incremental iterative changes that will suddenly make people happy. We are talking buffs in orders of magnitude if you wanna have anything resembling how it used to be.
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Jelle wrote:
Marco wrote:
Jelle wrote:Such a shame that you despise SP though.


Releasing the mod on SP implied exposing all intellectual property of the new engine to be reversed (as opposed to having a server-only engine as pretty much most modern games - which would also have allowed us to do lots of cool stuff), in addition to allowing it being stolen by diff communities (such as chinese one) which profit from it. In exchange, we have gotten nothing but complaints.

Gotta love when leeches complain how greedy we are.


Wanna show me where I mentioned anything about being greedy? Or is a straw man argument really the route you wanna take...

Literally all mods are "exposing all intellectual property", I don't know why you wanna pretend it's a big thing Sigma has done the same. Heck, other mods exposing their work is the entire reason Sigma exists to begin with.

You seem like a smart guy, but calling your long-time players for "leeches" makes it sound a lot like you have forgot what modding is about. (It also violates your own forum rules, but I got too thick skin to seriously complain about that).

Kudos for responding. Not so much for the lack of maturity.

edit: forgot to respond to
@RequiemLux
I love the message you're trying to convey, I really do... But the bottom line is that drop rates have been nerfed a metric f*ckton on SP. There's is no small incremental iterative changes that will suddenly make people happy. We are talking buffs in orders of magnitude if you wanna have anything resembling how it used to be.


If you want people to be mature around you, display maturity yourself. I can see why you might think that the devs hate you (SP-players), or whatever, because of a baseless claim of yours without any real evidence, but it really showcases why the SP playerbase is a meme.
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Marco
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Jelle wrote:Wanna show me where I mentioned anything about being greedy? Or is a straw man argument really the route you wanna take...

Literally all mods are "exposing all intellectual property", I don't know why you wanna pretend it's a big thing Sigma has done the same. Heck, other mods exposing their work is the entire reason Sigma exists to begin with.

You seem like a smart guy, but calling your long-time players for "leeches" makes it sound a lot like you have forgot what modding is about. (It also violates your own forum rules, but I got too thick skin to seriously complain about that).

Kudos for responding. Not so much for the lack of maturity.


I didn't call *you* specifically that, but the group of people you invoked - which love this theory that we "despise", or purposedly try to ruin the SP experience, so we can increase MP popularity for more bucks. I'm not trying to get admiration for "exposing IP", I am just stating reasons why we respect SP, because at the end of the day actions speak louder than words, and we haven't gotten anything out of it (nor expected).


You have provided little substance to your argument other than "uh no plugy yet???" but it hasn't even been a year, sigma took 6 years of development, and developers have their own life/jobs. It's just nerve-racking to see people bring provoking comments and demands, resurrecting threads. You are definetly helping a lot here mate, kudos.