Properly assessing the importance of oskills

[Zennith]

Great idea's in theory, however, since Ultimative the dev's have been removing these types of options either through just discarding or abandoning and I doubt they'll go back to them. The game used to have much more abstract or minor player choice that culminated into a much broader stroke than the cookie cutter Sigma is now. All thrown away for the benefit of new players.

[Primarch]

Some of the skills you are describing were good/great/viable at some point in their life, and then "balance" struck aka making them utter garbage and forgetting about it.
I personally prefer better balanced builds, than oskills. O-skills are fun as wacky end-game main skill and/or as a buff enhancing your characters build.
Builds and dungeons are not fun when you have to rely on a specific oskill to make them work.

Paladins are the perfect example of successful o skill implimentation. They have several viable Oskills baked into RWs and SSU’s (I.e. Cherubim). It’s simply a matter of balancing the ones already available. Lightning fury, for instance, is hot garbage. If all builds had a go-to unique or RW that added Oskill flavor on par with Cherubim, it might actually serve the dual purpose of both adding viability “balance” to underutilized core builds while lending a diversity of options to the Meta.

Then there’s the matter of synergies.. Oskills like Batstrike and Noctule are only good with talent synergies so why would they even be added to gloves/boots to begin with if they’ll never be successfully utilized? I’d recommend doing away with such failed implementation and buff oskills like Gorefest and bring back proc-builds that allow all classes operate outside limited class design.

[CMBurns]

As a new player, oskills are both the best and the worst part of the game. Having items granting you specific skills and trying to play around those is super flavorful and exciting. On the other hand, everything about how these skills work is so obscure. Some oskills are great at skill lvl 30, others are terrible at skill lvl 100. You can't find any info about the skill data anywhere, so you're always left guessing if an item with a cool-sounding oskill is good or completely garbage.

I'm sure it doesn't feel as bad for the players who have been playing for years and who know most of these skills, and maybe it's by design that players shouldn't be able to figure out skill power level too easily. But it really kills my motivation at trying fun builds, not having any idea how a late game skill will perform, given how hard the endgame content is. Throwing Power Keg on a Barb sounds awesome for instance, but there's also a decent chance it's an old oskill that haven't been relevant for 5 years, I have no idea and no way to know until I actually try it.

This brings up another very important point. A user who gets excited to try something he finds interesting or cool and ends up having wasted the time making a character only to find out what he was excited about just feels terrible to play.

It's very detrimental to the replay value of that person and another reason why making sure these skills feel fun and effective is vital.

[Captcha]

As a new player, oskills are both the best and the worst part of the game. Having items granting you specific skills and trying to play around those is super flavorful and exciting. On the other hand, everything about how these skills work is so obscure. Some oskills are great at skill lvl 30, others are terrible at skill lvl 100. You can't find any info about the skill data anywhere, so you're always left guessing if an item with a cool-sounding oskill is good or completely garbage.

I'm sure it doesn't feel as bad for the players who have been playing for years and who know most of these skills, and maybe it's by design that players shouldn't be able to figure out skill power level too easily. But it really kills my motivation at trying fun builds, not having any idea how a late game skill will perform, given how hard the endgame content is. Throwing Power Keg on a Barb sounds awesome for instance, but there's also a decent chance it's an old oskill that haven't been relevant for 5 years, I have no idea and no way to know until I actually try it.

I agree - as someone who's played this game a lot more than you have.


When d2 classic/clod was out I knew everything about the game (not easy, since its mechanics are rather opaque). Since then I can't be bothered with that level of research in any game I play - I have too much to do in life and I play too many games, so I just follow a guide.

There are few guides for oskill builds so I don't bother. Also, you have to have the items - worse, to get the skill to a playable level, it often requires more than one item, sometimes more than two. And they can be expensive/rare so not easy to "buy and try" and not easy to find in SP.

I thought the respec ability brought in in 2.0 was great - I've been asking for it for years - but the level 50 cap means that trying new builds is a pain.

I have previously suggested design options whereby oskills can be done differently (such as being bought from vendors) - there are so many ways this niche part of the game could vastly improve the mainstream game - but it does need to be accessible in a way that doesn't feel as if we're gambling a whole season on a build that may not work.

[Jampula]

I have always loved different oskills when the main build has grown dull, or in main game lvling process something like Apocalypse and Flash were a blast. I like op's ideas and would like to hear more. Maybe I'm just nostagic but I've grown to hate Relics and constant questions is this and this viable in labs? How the hell can you balance stuff for everyone without much more huge team of beta testers, both newbie and old players? And with TG and SSF? It seems impossible.

[Diaco]

Spiral Dance
- Has items dedicated to it
- Decent AoE
- Even with the orange text from Steel Punisher, the magic damage is very low
- Big delay between cast and hit makes it a very unenjoyable oskill to use
- With some tweaking could actually become a viable farming skill for melee WDM builds with low AoE skills like melee sorc or phys bear druid

Suggestions:
- Either buff the magic damage, or increase the scaling with skill levels, to at least open the possibility of building for +skills and going full magic damage
- Decrease the delay from the hit, or maybe even make the hit delay lower with skill level?
- Maybe increase damage for enemies closer to the center of the nova?


Rock Shock
- The WDM is ok, but the amount of targets is laughable
- Just a very terrible version of Parasite

Suggestion:
- Increase amount of targets with skill levels

[CMBurns]

Spiral Dance
- Has items dedicated to it
- Decent AoE
- Even with the orange text from Steel Punisher, the magic damage is very low
- Big delay between cast and hit makes it a very unenjoyable oskill to use
- With some tweaking could actually become a viable farming skill for melee WDM builds with low AoE skills like melee sorc or phys bear druid

Suggestions:
- Either buff the magic damage, or increase the scaling with skill levels, to at least open the possibility of building for +skills and going full magic damage
- Decrease the delay from the hit, or maybe even make the hit delay lower with skill level?
- Maybe increase damage for enemies closer to the center of the nova?


Rock Shock
- The WDM is ok, but the amount of targets is laughable
- Just a very terrible version of Parasite

Suggestion:
- Increase amount of targets with skill levels

I like these ideas!

[Berkabus1]

Is there any way to tag devs to This topic? I feel that This is a big problem. Also ive tried alot of different setups from start to end. In most cases (9/10) times it just isnt worth it. Better to make a paladin and go vessels , game done. I wouldnt say that This is a balance thingy but more like a chance to choose something different from whats on the table. The problem is that it doesnt matter since 9/10 oskills are utter shit.. remove or improve! Also more newb-friendly.

[RequiemLux]

Is there any way to tag devs to This topic?

No need to tag anyone, we are aware of everything
*cue ominous music*
we know your secrets

[Primarch]

Is there any way to tag devs to This topic?

No need to tag anyone, we are aware of everything
*cue ominous music*
we know your secrets

If this is true, how come I haven't been banned for my browser history?

Checkmate, MXL devs.