Javazon

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Urubuzin
Imp
5 | 0
I love poison builds. I love my poison Javazon in PD2. But I have problems trying poison jav on this mod.

Some suggestion to improve it would be making Noxious Mastery to provide like 3% avoid damage per base level to compensate for the fact the poison route doesn't have as much life as the physical route with Paragon.

Other suggestion would be making Elemental Aegis a passive like Prismatic Cloak and don't tie it with blocking because I can't block casters like Quov Tsin attacks. I am getting destroyed by it, rage quitted and then I had to make a poison assassin just for that because of her defenses against casters (perfect being and prismatic cloak that always absorbs elemental, no block tie bs).
metasequoia
Gravedigger
198 | 19
Ok this is a comment without knowledge because I've never played poison Java.

as far as i see it curare and noxious mastery gives you the option of defense on top of your (amazing) defenses through blocking. sounds good to me, you won't need ecstatic frenzy attack speed (=0 def) so yeah. also, together with bulwark you get an amazing 35% phys resists from skills (40% if you count tenacity).

I see from other players that poison is seemingly not endgame-viable due to low dmg output (that's sad) and i like my 19k hp physical java, yes.

also, you get 300% faster block FOR FREE, so you need only 134% for a ridiculously fast blocking animation, this is on par with only Necromancer who gets 3 frames with more effort, other chars dont even get to 3 frames blocking. Im not meaning to troll, im just saying that this build is literally the fastest, easiest... well, shieldmaiden you can get in this game (correct me if im wrong). those breakpoints matter a lot.

and the discussion with amazon vs assassin happened several times in this thread alone.
Urubuzin
Imp
5 | 0
metasequoia wrote:Ok this is a comment without knowledge because I've never played poison Java.

as far as i see it curare and noxious mastery gives you the option of defense on top of your (amazing) defenses through blocking. sounds good to me, you won't need ecstatic frenzy attack speed (=0 def) so yeah. also, together with bulwark you get an amazing 35% phys resists from skills (40% if you count tenacity).

I see from other players that poison is seemingly not endgame-viable due to low dmg output (that's sad) and i like my 19k hp physical java, yes.

also, you get 300% faster block FOR FREE, so you need only 134% for a ridiculously fast blocking animation, this is on par with only Necromancer who gets 3 frames with more effort, other chars dont even get to 3 frames blocking. Im not meaning to troll, im just saying that this build is literally the fastest, easiest... well, shieldmaiden you can get in this game (correct me if im wrong). those breakpoints matter a lot.

and the discussion with amazon vs assassin happened several times in this thread alone.


Poison Sin has easy physical resistance (35%+) with shadow refugee buff which also gives much more walking speed than zon has + all her convenient defenses like perfect being and prismatic.
metasequoia
Gravedigger
198 | 19
well sorry for this, i'm not gonna discuss assassin vs amazon again. it happened before in this thread. if assassin playstyle and concept suits you better, please play assassin and enjoy that :)
I actually like both very much (phys. Javazon and Trapsin main).
Urubuzin
Imp
5 | 0
metasequoia wrote:well sorry for this, i'm not gonna discuss assassin vs amazon again. it happened before in this thread. if assassin playstyle and concept suits you better, please play assassin and enjoy that :)
I actually like both very much (phys. Javazon and Trapsin main).


the point is having choice. poison javzon feels shitty compared to poison sin. so telling people to let poison jav rot bc it is shitty and bad and play with poison sin which is much better is not a good way to end a discussion. i like choice and to have as many builds viable to do all content as possible.

Having extreme trouble with Quov Tsin with psn jav to the point I rage quit and then getting a poison sin with similar level and comparable gear and having a much easier time and killing him with much less stress shows you that there is a problem with poison jav.
B_ATAKY
Sasquatch
60 | 3
Urubuzin wrote:
metasequoia wrote:well sorry for this, i'm not gonna discuss assassin vs amazon again. it happened before in this thread. if assassin playstyle and concept suits you better, please play assassin and enjoy that :)
I actually like both very much (phys. Javazon and Trapsin main).


the point is having choice. poison javzon feels shitty compared to poison sin. so telling people to let poison jav rot bc it is shitty and bad and play with poison sin which is much better is not a good way to end a discussion. i like choice and to have as many builds viable to do all content as possible.

Having extreme trouble with Quov Tsin with psn jav to the point I rage quit and then getting a poison sin with similar level and comparable gear and having a much easier time and killing him with much less stress shows you that there is a problem with poison jav.

Little tip. If you don't stand still with quov tsin, he wont be a problem.
Urubuzin
Imp
5 | 0
B_ATAKY wrote:
Urubuzin wrote:
metasequoia wrote:well sorry for this, i'm not gonna discuss assassin vs amazon again. it happened before in this thread. if assassin playstyle and concept suits you better, please play assassin and enjoy that :)
I actually like both very much (phys. Javazon and Trapsin main).


the point is having choice. poison javzon feels shitty compared to poison sin. so telling people to let poison jav rot bc it is shitty and bad and play with poison sin which is much better is not a good way to end a discussion. i like choice and to have as many builds viable to do all content as possible.

Having extreme trouble with Quov Tsin with psn jav to the point I rage quit and then getting a poison sin with similar level and comparable gear and having a much easier time and killing him with much less stress shows you that there is a problem with poison jav.

Little tip. If you don't stand still with quov tsin, he wont be a problem.


I stand in front of him with a sin and is not that bad. With psn jav I get insta destroyed.
Istaryu
Harpylisk
1442 | 58
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Urubuzin wrote:
B_ATAKY wrote:
Urubuzin wrote:
metasequoia wrote:well sorry for this, i'm not gonna discuss assassin vs amazon again. it happened before in this thread. if assassin playstyle and concept suits you better, please play assassin and enjoy that :)
I actually like both very much (phys. Javazon and Trapsin main).


the point is having choice. poison javzon feels shitty compared to poison sin. so telling people to let poison jav rot bc it is shitty and bad and play with poison sin which is much better is not a good way to end a discussion. i like choice and to have as many builds viable to do all content as possible.

Having extreme trouble with Quov Tsin with psn jav to the point I rage quit and then getting a poison sin with similar level and comparable gear and having a much easier time and killing him with much less stress shows you that there is a problem with poison jav.

Little tip. If you don't stand still with quov tsin, he wont be a problem.


I stand in front of him with a sin and is not that bad. With psn jav I get insta destroyed.


Becuase sin has lots of flat dmg reduction which is strong against qts beam which does lots of small dmg very fast.
User avatar
Maertsy
Rust Claw
87 | 8
And QT beams don't trigger the Javazon blocks so..
You can just use melee Impale instead of throwing. He does less dam at melee range.
metasequoia
Gravedigger
198 | 19
Yes this is actually the weakness of Javazon in general, casters like QT and Sam and Scosglen Boss and Deimoss. No blocking, no defense, and this is part of the defensive concept of the build with is unique.

and, to make this more of a point, exactly this is the strength of Assassin defenses, casters. So a comparison is difficult, because they work quite different.

That does not, indeed, make the point of "it would be nice if poison Java would be able to do endgame stuff" invalid. But what i don't like is the idea of "every poison build should have the exact same power level" because, following that logic, every melee build should have the exact same power level etc., which is a ridiculously difficult task to accomplish for people who do this for fun in the end.

As QT is a midgame boss, have you tried to use little helpful things like
Aerin Orbiter
Aerin Orbiter
Belt (4)

Defense: (88 - 96) to (121 - 132)
Required Level: 5
Required Strength: 28
Item Level: 10
5% Cast Speed
+(4 to 5)% to Fire Spell Damage
+(4 to 5)% to Lightning Spell Damage
+(4 to 5)% to Cold Spell Damage
+(18 to 29)% Enhanced Defense
+(11 to 15) to Energy
Elemental Resists +(3 to 5)%
Elemental/Magic Damage Reduced by (3 to 5)
Socketed (1)
Defense: (310 - 334) to (389 - 419)
Required Level: 22
Required Strength: 56
Item Level: 31
15% Cast Speed
+(8 to 9)% to Fire Spell Damage
+(8 to 9)% to Lightning Spell Damage
+(8 to 9)% to Cold Spell Damage
+(41 to 52)% Enhanced Defense
+(21 to 25) to Energy
Elemental Resists +(9 to 11)%
Elemental/Magic Damage Reduced by (9 to 11)
Socketed (2)
Defense: (754 - 805) to (938 - 1001)
Required Level: 40
Required Strength: 201
Item Level: 51
25% Cast Speed
+(12 to 13)% to Fire Spell Damage
+(12 to 13)% to Lightning Spell Damage
+(12 to 13)% to Cold Spell Damage
+(64 to 75)% Enhanced Defense
+(31 to 35) to Energy
Elemental Resists +(15 to 17)%
Elemental/Magic Damage Reduced by (15 to 17)
Socketed (2)
Defense: (1104 - 1173) to (1358 - 1443)
Required Level: 48
Required Strength: 402
Item Level: 77
30% Cast Speed
+(14 to 15)% to Fire Spell Damage
+(14 to 15)% to Lightning Spell Damage
+(14 to 15)% to Cold Spell Damage
+(75 to 86)% Enhanced Defense
+(36 to 40) to Energy
Elemental Resists +(18 to 20)%
Elemental/Magic Damage Reduced by (18 to 20)
Socketed (2)
and
Wheel of Fortune
Wheel of Fortune
Large Shield (4)

Defense: 85 to 162
Chance to Block: Class%
Required Level: 4
Required Strength: 27
Required Dexterity: 45
Item Level: 10
+(21 to 30) to Vitality
Maximum Elemental Resists +1%
Elemental Resists +(6 to 10)%
Fire Absorb 1%
Lightning Absorb 1%
Cold Absorb 1%
(4 to 7)% Gold Find
(5 to 10)% Magic Find
Socketed (1)
Defense: 240 to 405
Chance to Block: Class%
Required Level: 21
Required Strength: 53
Required Dexterity: 67
Item Level: 31
+(31 to 40) to Vitality
Maximum Elemental Resists +1%
Elemental Resists +(11 to 20)%
Fire Absorb 2%
Lightning Absorb 2%
Cold Absorb 2%
(9 to 12)% Gold Find
(11 to 20)% Magic Find
Socketed (3)
Defense: 501 to 817
Chance to Block: Class%
Required Level: 39
Required Strength: 184
Required Dexterity: 139
Item Level: 51
+(41 to 50) to Vitality
Maximum Elemental Resists +2%
Elemental Resists +(21 to 30)%
Fire Absorb 2%
Lightning Absorb 2%
Cold Absorb 2%
(14 to 17)% Gold Find
(21 to 30)% Magic Find
Socketed (4)
Defense: 684 to 1113
Chance to Block: Class%
Required Level: 48
Required Strength: 368
Required Dexterity: 288
Item Level: 77
+(51 to 60) to Vitality
Maximum Elemental Resists +2%
Elemental Resists +(31 to 40)%
Fire Absorb 3%
Lightning Absorb 3%
Cold Absorb 3%
(17 to 19)% Gold Find
(31 to 40)% Magic Find
Socketed (4)
to increase your elemental defenses? also, overcapping res (by 20%) might help against mythal, and melee range (as op stated) gives you additional protection to apply strong poison from impale.